Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

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Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by SamCogar on Tue Jun 23, 2009 5:47 am

"When people are stressed out, they smoke and drink and play the Lottery more," he said.

Though May, cigarette tax collections are at $99,579,279 -- about $1.98 million, or 2 percent, ahead of estimates.

Smokeless tobacco taxes are also running about 1.35 percent, or $675,528, ahead of the $4.98 million year-to-date estimate.

Likewise, liquor revenues are up 1 percent, or $1.13 million ahead of estimates, at $13.9 million.

The only sin tax falling short of estimates is the beer tax, and its year-to-date collections of $7,555,175 are just 0.01 percent behind the projected $7.6 million.

And, as McKown alluded, overall state Lottery profits are down about $4.5 million from the same point in 2008, a decline of 0.83 percent.

West Virginia's relatively low cigarette and smokeless tobacco taxes may account for those revenues running ahead of projections, McKown noted.

At 55 cents a pack, West Virginia's cigarette tax is lower than all its border states but Virginia and Kentucky, each at 30 cents a pack. However, on July 1, Kentucky's tax will double to 60 cents a pack.

West Virginia's tax is well below Maryland ($2 a pack), Pennsylvania ($1.35 a pack) and Ohio ($1.25 a pack),

http://www.wvgazette.com/News/200906220687

11 months of sinful tax collections:

$5,655,528 – snuff/chewing tobacco profits
$7,555,175 – beer profits
$13,900,000 – liquor profits
$99,579,279 – cigarettes profits
$542,168,675 – lottery profits

$668,858,657 TOTAL SINFUL PROFITS

.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by Aaron on Tue Jun 23, 2009 9:33 am

It is how FDR paid for the New Deal.
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ziggy on Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:14 pm

These are the taxes easiest to legally avoid paying.

Just don't buy the stuff.
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by Aaron on Tue Jun 23, 2009 3:08 pm

LOL...And's that how liberals justify taxing the poor at a higher rate to pay for the programs that are supposed to help them. What a load.
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ohio county on Tue Jun 23, 2009 3:23 pm

You're exactly right. Poor people are taxed progressively on sin taxes. This exposes the sham that liberals just want to look out for the little people. It turns out, they just want to boss somebody around...

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by SamCogar on Tue Jun 23, 2009 3:26 pm

Socialist lefty authoritarians always have a simple excuse for an answer for unjust treatment for selected groups of people.

They think it is perfectly alright for the government to levy horrendous taxes on tobacco users to pay salaries of public employees and health care for poor children ...... and use everyone's taxes to pay for all healthcare, housing, workers comp and/or disability payments to drunks, dope addicts and obese people because they can't help themselves, ....... they all have a disease they can't control.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by Stephanie on Tue Jun 23, 2009 4:04 pm

What, poor people are not deserving of liberty?

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by SamCogar on Tue Jun 23, 2009 4:11 pm

Not at the expense of the working poor.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ziggy on Tue Jun 23, 2009 5:43 pm

So why do none of you refute my suggestion that the way for the poor- or for anyone- to avoid the so-called "sin taxes" is simply to not buy the "sin products"?

Nothing beats taxes on products like the consumer- whether rich or poor- who says, "I'll be damned before I buy that over-taxed product"- and then doesn't.

As Cato says, it is about choices and conduct. And our choices about what we chose to buy or not buy has consequences- about as direct consequences as anything we do in life.
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by Stephanie on Tue Jun 23, 2009 6:37 pm

There are other options. You can brew your own beer and wine etc, and more and more people are doing so.

Now, don't poor folks deserve liberty too?

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ohio county on Tue Jun 23, 2009 7:08 pm

Oh, no. Nanny government says that smoking is no good for the poor. The government will, therefore, in their own interests, tax tobacco beyond their ability to pay for it. Government knows best.

Ziggy doesn't that take free choice away from the poor? To answer your question: yes, poor people can make the choice to quit. They can also be forced into it by a government that makes their choices for them and then enforces those choices through taxation. Avoid the sin taxes? Wouldn't it make more sense to overthrow the government that restricts their freedoms?

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ziggy on Tue Jun 23, 2009 7:50 pm

Ziggy doesn't that take free choice away from the poor?

No, I don't think so. Actually, it makes the choices more starkly apparent.

To answer your question: yes, poor people can make the choice to quit. They can also be forced into it by a government that makes their choices for them and then enforces those choices through taxation.

But the article Sam posted tells us otherwise- that "sin taxed" purchases are increasing.

Avoid the sin taxes? Wouldn't it make more sense to overthrow the government that restricts their freedoms?

Maybe, but the government doesn't allow that to happen.

Anyway, the only folks I see advocating overthrowing the government are folks who- whatever they are- are not poor. So I have to question how genuine is their concern for "the poor".
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ohio county on Tue Jun 23, 2009 7:55 pm

Well, I'm not advocating taxing them until they submit to my will... Back at you.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ziggy on Tue Jun 23, 2009 8:10 pm

Former Jackson County Republican Delegate Bill Carmichael (now deceased) told me that he figured the best kind of tax was one that people were most willing to pay.

That was his justification for voting to get the state deeper into the "lottery" business almost 20 years ago- but which I was opposed to.

Maybe he was onto something. The more state operated gambling opportunities there are, the more money folks seem willing to plow into them.
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by Stephanie on Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:07 pm

It's really disturbing to hear that some think liberty should be available only to people of affluence.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by Aaron on Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:18 pm

Obama KNEW how he was going to pay for his record spending long before he ever proposed it, got it passed and signed it into law.

Pathetic.

But then what actions has he undertaken aren't?
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ziggy on Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:45 pm

Stephanie wrote:It's really disturbing to hear that some think liberty should be available only to people of affluence.

Liberty to do what? To purchase whatever they want to purchase? That is a fact of economic life- that more affluence results in more purchasing power.

"Sin taxes" apply to the more affluent as well as to the less affluent.
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by Stephanie on Wed Jun 24, 2009 12:53 am

These "sin" taxes are instituted specifically for the disparity of economic impact they will have.

This isn't about buying power. This is about the freedom of citizens to live their lives as they choose. What right does the government have to make gamblers pay more in taxes than crossword puzzle fans?

The government doesn't have the right to enforce morality on people. Smoking and drinking and gambling aren't pc so let's wring the people who smoke or drink or gamble dry, right?

What the government is doing will ultimately lead to more and more black market tobacco and liquor products.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ohio county on Wed Jun 24, 2009 6:12 am

"Sin taxes" apply to the more affluent as well as to the less affluent.

Since they are regressive they are particularly cruel to those who can ill afford them. I thought all you progressive types were all for progressive taxes and soaking the rich. No?

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by SamCogar on Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:33 am

Stephanie wrote:It's really disturbing to hear that some think liberty should be available only to people of affluence.

RIGHT, like this person.

Get a whiff: Obama admits occasional cigarette
President confirms gossip that he hasn’t entirely kicked his smoking habit

WASHINGTON - It fell to President Barack Obama to confirm the gossip that his aides had spent weeks trying to snuff out: He still sneaks an occasional cigarette.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31512752/ns/white_house/


Does he really give a damn how much taxes they levy on a pack of cigarettes?

Do the Legislators in Charleston who still retain THEIR RIGHT to smoke in their offices give a damn either?

I think Ziggy is for any Law that imposes unjust restrictions and/or punishment on anyone but himself.

The Psychiatrists have a name for that but I forget what its called.


.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by SamCogar on Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:50 am

Stephanie wrote:What the government is doing will ultimately lead to more and more black market tobacco and liquor products.

Right on, Steph, and the prime candidate for an optional choice for solveing their need for getting a "good feeling" from either is ........ Wacky Tobacca.

One doesn’t have to pay any tax when they purchase marijuana ……. and one doesn’t have to pay income taxes on the profits from selling the marijuana.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by SamCogar on Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:11 am

Does anyone think that the Ziggies of the world really give a damn about such things as this?

$21,455,175 – WV beer & liquor profits
verses
$99,579,279 – WV cigarettes profits


Cigarette tax profits are 5 times as much,

yet beer & liquor is probably responsible for
5 times more health and property expenses
than is cigarettes.


,

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by Cato on Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:36 am

Stephanie wrote:

This isn't about buying power. This is about the freedom of citizens to live their lives as they choose. What right does the government have to make gamblers pay more in taxes than crossword puzzle fans?

Freedom. We aren't free. Most have sold their soul to the government for a few bobbles and the promise of some sort of protection.

All sin taxes amount to is a revenue source for the parasites in Charleston and Washington.

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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ziggy on Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:23 pm

"Sin taxes" apply to the more affluent as well as to the less affluent.

Since they are regressive they are particularly cruel to those who can ill afford them. I thought all you progressive types were all for progressive taxes and soaking the rich. No?

How are they "regressive"? Again, if you don't want to pay the tax, then don't buy the damn stuff.

I buy a bottle of liquor now and then- bought two of 'em tonight. And but for the tax I'd probably buy and consume a lot more of it a lot more often. But Ms. Ziggy and I do not need liquor to survive. And so, like the occassional Powerball ticket, it is a luxury we avail ourselves of only occasionally.
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Re: Sin taxes are the real sin being perpetrated.

Post by ziggy on Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:31 pm

Does anyone think that the Ziggies of the world really give a damn about such things as this?

$21,455,175 – WV beer & liquor profits
verses
$99,579,279 – WV cigarettes profits


Cigarette tax profits are 5 times as much,

yet beer & liquor is probably responsible for
5 times more health and property expenses
than is cigarettes.


,

Then don't buy the beer and liquor. Or don't buy the cigarettes. Or buy both and drink and smoke to you heart's content. It's your choice.
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