WV Forum for News, Politics, and Sports
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

The Ethanol Hoax

+3
Aaron
shermangeneral
SamCogar
7 posters

Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty The Ethanol Hoax

Post by SamCogar Sun May 11, 2008 5:46 am

received via an E-mail

Thus is a "must read" for those who are clueless to reality.

A Gallon Of Gas And The Ethanol Hoax
By Thomas D. Segel
April 25, 2008

When I read the newspaper or view the nightly television news shows I can't help but feel almost uncontrollable anger. And the truth is, I really don't know where that anger should be directed. I listen to my fellow citizens anguish about the price of fuel, the price of food and sticker shock at everything they want to purchase. They have great concerns about the price of gas at the local station and the cost of milk at the super market. And they blame the politicians for inaction, along with greedy farmers and Big Oil for high prices. With their next breath they are crying for more of our corn based ethanol to help lower prices at the pump. It is enough to make a rational person want to bash his or her head against the nearest hard object in complete frustration.

For the past thirty plus years we have allowed the environmental activists of the Democratic Party to, stop all forward movement in our national quest for energy independence. We know how to obtain oil from places such as Alaska, Wyoming and the Dakotas, but legislation to drill has been blocked. We know oil is waiting offshore, but we are not allowed to drill due to environmental impact, even though other nations are reaching for that same oil, just a few miles away.

We have even allowed these same activists to stop the building of new oil refineries for the past 30 years.

Our energy demands from abroad could be reduced by nuclear power, but the socialist led environmentalists have swayed enough pandering politicians to stop the production of nuclear power plants. Other socialist-activists who hide behind the green wall of environmentalism have slowed the much touted wind farms of this country to almost a standstill. When construction is almost at hand there is always another call for a study to see if these wind farms will kill migrating birds, or perhaps block Ted Kennedy's oceanfront view.

Though the United States has enough coal to handle the majority of our energy needs for decades, political roadblocks keep on appearing to slow the rapid development of coal based technology.

While on the topic of energy concerns, lets not forget the political love affair with corn-based ethanol. To say this bio fuel is a gigantic con game perpetrated by corn producers and politicos would be an understatement. We must add into the mix major corporations that keep the myth of reduced dependence on oil alive, because they are financially invested in bio-fuels.

When we examine the politician's incessant praising of corn based ethanol, we fail to understand these are really people who are prostituting themselves for more votes and financial support from the agro-community.

Ethanol, as we produce it today, is 20% less efficient than gasoline. It takes 450 pounds of corn to produce enough ethanol to fill the tank of the average American automobile. (Think about that for a minute. It also takes about 450 pounds of corn to feed one person for a year.) It is too corrosive to be shipped via pipeline and must be trucked to distribution points. Added to these negatives...it takes more than one gallon of fossil fuel, coal, oil, or natural gas, to produce one gallon of ethanol.

Writing on the Mother Jones website, Cameron Scott says, "To grow enough corn for ethanol to replace our oil addiction would require approximately 482 million acres of cropland, exceeding the total of 434 million acres of cropland used for all food and fiber. This does not even account for projected growth of oil consumption in the U.S."

Added to these problem areas, ethanol production increases, rather than reduces, environmental concerns. Production requires the application of petroleum-based fertilizers that have contributed heavily to the emission of nitrous oxide, a greenhouse gas 300 times more potent than carbon dioxide. To produce a gallon of ethanol requires three to five gallons of water and results in 13 gallons of toxic trash and wastewater. It takes the energy equivalent of 113 liters of gas to treat this waste.

Dr. Walter Williams, the distinguished author, columnist and professor at George Mason University says, "The grain based ethanol hoax is a sterling example of a program economists refer to as narrow, well-defined benefits versus widely dispersed costs. It pays the ethanol lobby to organize and collect money to grease the palms of politicians willing to do their bidding because there is a large benefit to them - higher wages and profits. The millions of fuel consumers, who fund these benefits through higher fuel costs and food prices, as well as taxes, are relatively uninformed and have little clout."

So, we tolerate $6.00 corn used to produce $2.00 ethanol, which is also subsidized by the government to the tune of $1.05 to $1.38 per gallon, because it would not survive on the free market. Thus, we allow the costs to each of us personally to increase even more, because those subsidies come directly from our tax dollars.

But, we haven't finished here. How about that box of cereal, or that steak, or that gallon of milk? Have you checked market prices lately?

Last night a woman on the evening news was telling the reporter that, " I had to choose between paying about $3.50 for a gallon of gas, or buying a gallon of milk for my children."

A convenience store operator told the news reporter that the high price of gas had resulted in him losing customers. "People don't fill their tanks", he said. "And they don't come in to the store and buy things like they did before. I am making much less money in my business."

Yes, prices have sky rocketed on everything from beef to milk and cereal to soda pop. Even beer has jumped in price, because corn and other grains are being diverted into producing fuels.

Reporting in the Des Moines Register, Philip Brasher has noted "A Senate-passed energy bill would require the use of 15 billion gallons of ethanol by 2015, more than double what motorists are expected to use this year. The mandate would be raised to 36 billion gallons by 2022."

At the same time difficulties in transporting the bio fuel to distant locales have produced a glut of ethanol in Iowa and Nebraska, thus dropping the price by 50 cents a gallon and, of course, increasing the subsidies paid to the producers. Even with this happening dozens of plants are under construction and current distilleries are being expanded. More corn is being planted to feed the bio fuel industry and less corn and other grains are being raised to feed the hungry.

So, as you look at high prices everywhere there are a lot of people you can blame.

You can point your rage at Big Oil, Big Industry, Big Farmers, Big Politicians...and on and on. But, the person you really should be angry at owns that face you see every day in the mirror.

Too many of us expected the politicians to be fathers, mothers and nannies combined. What they really ended up doing is stealing our modern way of life.

SamCogar

Number of posts : 6238
Location : Burnsville, WV
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by shermangeneral Sun May 11, 2008 7:50 am

Well Sam I tend to agree with your criticism of the headlong dash toward ethanol from corn.

However ethanol derived from other sources seems like it might make more sense.

I also suspect on your political argument you might be a little misinformed.

If lefties are all for it, why did you cite Mother Jones magazine to bolster your argument?

(they are about as left as it gets.)

I suspect that republican politicians from corn belt states are just as quick to go after subsidies as Dems are.

I could be wrong, that is just my instinct. But I doubt it.

Do you have any source to cite that it is just Democrats?

And finally, as I understand most of the Alaska oil production now goes to Japan. So if they increase production by allowing them to drill in ANWR wouldnt they just sell that to Japan as well?

shermangeneral

Number of posts : 1347
Location : Sherman, WV
Registration date : 2007-12-30

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by Aaron Sun May 11, 2008 8:29 am

Am I to understand that you disagree with the assessment of the letter Sam posted Sherm?
Aaron
Aaron

Number of posts : 9841
Age : 58
Location : Putnam County for now
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by shermangeneral Sun May 11, 2008 8:45 am

Well Aaron like I said above I agree with parts of it but have some questions about other parts.

In particular the political generalizations.

Like I said I could be wrong but I doubt it is just Dems who want subsidies.

Do you think it would be just Dems, or would you tend to believe republicans from farm states would favor subsidies too?

shermangeneral

Number of posts : 1347
Location : Sherman, WV
Registration date : 2007-12-30

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by Aaron Sun May 11, 2008 8:48 am

I'm quite sure all politicans effected want subsidies Sherm. That doesn't chage the facts that ethonal does more harm then it ever will good and the best thing America could do right now is abandon all plants and let B-1 pilots practice.
Aaron
Aaron

Number of posts : 9841
Age : 58
Location : Putnam County for now
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by ohio county Sun May 11, 2008 11:13 am

Ethanol and the first-come/first served nature of the various Farm Bills are bipartisan and regional in nature.
ohio county
ohio county
Moderator

Number of posts : 3207
Location : Wheeling
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by shermangeneral Sun May 11, 2008 12:34 pm

Thanks OC. I meant to research that and post a link for Aaron but since you can confirm I will let it ride.

I was over on the other thread defending myself. So I forgot I was on a mission to document my bi-partisan porkbarrel theory.

btw do u know anything about ethanol being derived from hemp or other non-food sources?

I understand Brazil is going great guns with ethanol from sugarcane, but that is gonna run up the cost of rum isnt it?

shermangeneral

Number of posts : 1347
Location : Sherman, WV
Registration date : 2007-12-30

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by Aaron Sun May 11, 2008 2:16 pm

I hope they have better luck with their sugarcane then we have. In addition to all the previous ills that we know about ethonal, the MPG's are about 2/3rds of regular gasoline. At what point is this garbage going to stop?

Some of the facts are listed here.
Aaron
Aaron

Number of posts : 9841
Age : 58
Location : Putnam County for now
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by SamCogar Mon May 12, 2008 8:36 am

shermangeneral wrote:I understand Brazil is going great guns with ethanol from sugarcane, but that is gonna run up the cost of rum isnt it?

Sherm, who cares?

No one in West Virginia or Kentucky will.

GEEEZE, now just what hillybilly or mountainman would be caught drinking rum, ifffen he can drink "White Lightning"? geek geek geek geek


Ethanol, also called ethyl alcohol, grain alcohol, or drinking alcohol, is a flammable, colorless, chemical compound. It is best known as the type of alcohol found in alcoholic beverages and in thermometers. In common usage, it is often referred to simply as alcohol.


.

SamCogar

Number of posts : 6238
Location : Burnsville, WV
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by SheikBen Mon May 12, 2008 8:53 am

Sherman,

Surely you realize that an increase in the price of corn is a quite more disastrous situation than more expensive sugar or rum?

The one piece of data that I am actually happy to see is that our consumption has actually been affected by all of this. I have been convinced for awhile, and I still am, that until we change our behavior, nothing will change on the price of gas or oil. Of course the Chinese and India will continue to screw us, but we have to show OPEC that we are serious about using less of what they have, developing alternatives without them, and planning on a post-OPEC reality.

SheikBen
Moderator

Number of posts : 3445
Age : 48
Location : The Soviet Socialist Republic of Illinois
Registration date : 2008-01-02

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by shermangeneral Mon May 12, 2008 9:22 am

Well Mike I was jesting about the price of rum ok.

That is one drawback to this forum is that no one can tell when you are kidding.

No body language, etc.

I should have added an lol to my comment about rum.

shermangeneral

Number of posts : 1347
Location : Sherman, WV
Registration date : 2007-12-30

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by SheikBen Mon May 12, 2008 9:54 am

You're right, Sherm. Mea culpa.

I posted my response before I had an adequate amount of coffee this morning to appreciate jesting:)

SheikBen
Moderator

Number of posts : 3445
Age : 48
Location : The Soviet Socialist Republic of Illinois
Registration date : 2008-01-02

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by ohio county Mon May 12, 2008 10:46 am

I recognized your humor, shermangeneral. But, like Sam, I've never developed a taste for rum. I only like it when the cupboard is bare.
ohio county
ohio county
Moderator

Number of posts : 3207
Location : Wheeling
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by shermangeneral Mon May 12, 2008 10:53 am

Well I hope a magical clean source of energy can be found or made cheaply.

shermangeneral

Number of posts : 1347
Location : Sherman, WV
Registration date : 2007-12-30

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by ohio county Mon May 12, 2008 10:56 am

I hope the price of rum stays cheap.
ohio county
ohio county
Moderator

Number of posts : 3207
Location : Wheeling
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by SheikBen Mon May 12, 2008 10:57 am

It strikes me the most common product made from Rum in West Virginia is little West Virginians.

SheikBen
Moderator

Number of posts : 3445
Age : 48
Location : The Soviet Socialist Republic of Illinois
Registration date : 2008-01-02

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by ohio county Mon May 12, 2008 11:13 am

In many families it is common to have at least one child named "Rummy". I made that up. I couldn't help it.
ohio county
ohio county
Moderator

Number of posts : 3207
Location : Wheeling
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by SheikBen Mon May 12, 2008 11:15 am

Glad you couldn't help it.

Now I will fear for anyone whose nickname is "Brownie."

SheikBen
Moderator

Number of posts : 3445
Age : 48
Location : The Soviet Socialist Republic of Illinois
Registration date : 2008-01-02

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by ziggy Mon May 12, 2008 11:17 am

Ironically, the only liquor Ms. Ziggy will drink is rum with Coca-Cola. But at our age the conduct it enhances is not very apt to contribute to any more little Ziggys. So bring on the rum, but keep it cheap!
ziggy
ziggy
Moderator

Number of posts : 5731
Location : Jackson County, WV
Registration date : 2007-12-28

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by Stephanie Mon May 12, 2008 3:39 pm

ohio county wrote:I recognized your humor, shermangeneral. But, like Sam, I've never developed a taste for rum. I only like it when the cupboard is bare.

What are you people? Barbarians? There is nothing like good rum. OK, well there is good spiced rum. If I didn't have kids the Captain and I would be very intimately acquainted nearly every evening.....I would make exceptions for those times when I'm in the mood for Pyrat, and when I can afford it of course.....which will be never if our economy doesn't improve, damn it.
Stephanie
Stephanie
Admin

Number of posts : 6556
Age : 60
Location : West Virginia
Registration date : 2007-12-28

https://gazzfriends.forumotion.com

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by Stephanie Mon May 12, 2008 3:41 pm

I knew I liked that Mrs. Ziggy. Buy a bottle of Pyrat. She'll enjoy that straight up. Tis good stuff, I'm tellin' ya.
Stephanie
Stephanie
Admin

Number of posts : 6556
Age : 60
Location : West Virginia
Registration date : 2007-12-28

https://gazzfriends.forumotion.com

Back to top Go down

The Ethanol Hoax Empty Re: The Ethanol Hoax

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum