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Who McCain should pick

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SheikBen
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Post by SheikBen Mon Aug 25, 2008 10:17 am

I think John McCain should pick Sarah Palin for VP. She is committed to the pro-life position, youthful and energetic, and a popular Governor. As a chief executive of a state, she has leadership experience that would please some voters (that we'll have a non-Governor in the White House next January will be noteworthy, as Carter, Reagan, Clinton, and Bush 43 were all governors, Bush 41 being the exception). Lastly, I think a Palin choice could get some disaffected Clinton supporters to vote for McCain. Without a female on the ticket, I don't see the Clinton supporters actually making good on their threats to vote for McCain.

What do you all think?

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Post by ziggy Mon Aug 25, 2008 10:27 am

McCain - Palin? Republican dream team for 2008? Maybe.

But then, the Republican sexists might have to swallow really hard.
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Post by SheikBen Mon Aug 25, 2008 10:33 am

I don't think they are nearly as numerous as you'd think.

And they probably are often uneducated, making them less likely to vote.

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Post by ohio county Mon Aug 25, 2008 1:03 pm

I like Sarah Palin, too. I'm not sure if there is any merit to the charge she discharged (or tried to discharge) her ex-brother-in-law, the state trooper.

Byron York says it's either Tim Pawlenty or Joe Lieberman. If McCain senses he's won, it will be Lieberman. If he thinks theres a chance he could lose in November, he will select Pawlenty.
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Post by Stephanie Mon Aug 25, 2008 1:57 pm

If McCain chooses Palin I would be tempted to vote for him. I really like Governor Palin, not enough to actually vote for McCain, but a whole lot.

On the other hand, if John McCain chooses Joe Lieberman, I will very likely begin actively campaigning for Obama. No kidding.
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Post by SheikBen Mon Aug 25, 2008 2:06 pm

Hi Stephanie,

I have been flirting with the idea of voting for McCain (as I live in IL it really doesn't matter who I vote for). If Lieberman is his running mate, I will certainly vote for Alan Keyes. I think a Lieberman choice is the kiss of death for John McCain, and if he can't make THAT choice, I guess I'm glad he won't be making any others as President!

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Post by SheikBen Mon Aug 25, 2008 2:08 pm

I don't think Pawlenty is a good call, either, although I like him well enough. I don't see Minnesota swinging for the Republicans, I just don't.

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Post by Stephanie Mon Aug 25, 2008 2:18 pm

If Palin would accept the job, I really think she is the best choice for McCain. She has demonstrated both leadership and the personal values rank and file conservatives hold is such high regard.

She is pro-life, favors drilling in ANWR, and is fiscally conservative. She has proven her abilities as chief executive. She will smooth the ruffled feathers of many Republicans with serious reservations about McCain's stance on issues like abortion and illegal immigration. I believe many of those Clinton supporters who are undecided will make up their minds in a hurry to support the team with the girl.

I'm just not all that convinced she'd be willing to go along for the ride. She has very young children, including a newborn with a disability.
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Post by Aaron Mon Aug 25, 2008 2:34 pm

She's also a relative new comer and given McCain's age, I'm not so sure you would be as well received if he were say, 10 years younger.

Donnie (my WVU student) told me read this weekend that that McCain was considering Colin Powell as a possible VP candidate.

Thoughts?
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Post by Stephanie Mon Aug 25, 2008 3:00 pm

I don't think Colin Powell could possibly help McCain anywhere near as much as Palin. Powell won't get the pro-life vote, or the womens vote. He is viewed as strong in areas of military and foreign policy, same as John McCain.

Sheesh that page is taking forever to load.....

Ah, "star quality". I'd say that's really all he has to offer to the ticket. Still, he'd be a better choice than Lieberman!
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Post by Aaron Mon Aug 25, 2008 4:51 pm

It's not that I would wish ill will on anyone but I would vote for a McCain/Powell ticket in hopes of Tyleresque style time frame promotion.
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Post by ziggy Mon Aug 25, 2008 5:00 pm

I don't think Colin Powell could possibly help McCain anywhere near as much as Palin. Powell won't get the pro-life vote, or the womens vote. He is viewed as strong in areas of military and foreign policy, same as John McCain.

Right. But when McCain would need a prop for a warmongering WMD scare, then ole' Colin could just whip out that little vial of fake anthrax from his pocket, and the show could begin.
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Post by Stephanie Mon Aug 25, 2008 5:04 pm

Are you insinuating the threatening letters with the white powder of a few days ago were a campaign stunt?
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Post by Aaron Mon Aug 25, 2008 5:18 pm

The words of the democratic VP candidate and chairman of the foreign relations committee on Meet the Press in 2007.

MR. RUSSERT: I want to go back to 2002, because it’s important as to what people were saying then and what the American people were hearing. Here’s Joe Biden about Saddam Hussein: “He’s a long term threat and a short term threat to our national security.”

“We have no choice but to eliminate the threat. This is a guy who is an extreme danger to the world.”

“He must be dislodged from his weapons or dislodged from power.” You were emphatic about that.

SEN. BIDEN: That’s right, and I was correct about that. He must be, in fact—and remember the weapons we were talking about. I also said on your show, that’s part of what I said, but not all of what I meant. What I also said on your show at the time was that I did not think he had weaponized his material, but he did have. When, when the inspectors left after Saddam kicked them out, there was a cataloguing at the United Nations saying he had X tons of, X amount of, and they listed the various materials he had. The big issue, remember, on this show we talked about, was whether he had weaponized them. Remember you asked me about those flights that were taking place in southern Iraq, where—were they spraying anthrax? And, you know, what would happen? And, you know, so on and so forth. And I pointed out to you that they had not developed that capacity at all. But he did have these stockpiles everywhere.

MR. RUSSERT: Where are they?

SEN. BIDEN: Well, the point is, it turned out they didn’t, but everyone in the world thought he had them.

The weapons inspectors said he had them. He catalogued—they catalogued them. This was not some, some Cheney, you know, pipe dream. This was, in fact, catalogued. They looked at them and catalogued. What he did with them, who knows? The real mystery is, if he, if he didn’t have any of them left, why didn’t he say so? Well, a lot of people say if he had said that, he would’ve, you know, emboldened Iran and so on and so forth.

He even stated that weapons were catalogued by weapons inspectors. Seems to me one particular poster has said over and over again that weapons inspectors said there were no WMD's. So who's lying. The chairman of the foreign relations committee or ?????
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Post by ziggy Mon Aug 25, 2008 5:47 pm

Stephanie wrote:Are you insinuating the threatening letters with the white powder of a few days ago were a campaign stunt?

No, not at all.

But I am suggesting that the show Powell made at the U.N. in February of 2003 was a fake warmongering stunt.
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Post by ziggy Mon Aug 25, 2008 6:06 pm

the Bush administration and Congress ignored the widely-available findings of the UN weapons inspectors weeks before the U.S. invasion.

On Feb. 13, 2003, the chief UN inspector, Hans Blix, reported to the UN Security Council that there was no evidence of either active chemical or biological weapons programs or stockpiles. International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) Director-General Mohamed ElBaradei reported that there was no evidence of a reconstituted nuclear weapons program. On the basis of leads provided by U.S. and other intelligence agencies and information gained from earlier inspections, the UN inspectors conducted more than 760 inspections covering about 500 sites from November 2002 through February 2003.

The UN inspectors’ findings directly contradicted key assessments of the October 2002 NIE and provided ample reason to reassess that document, which was based entirely on information gathered before the return of the UN inspectors in November of 2002.

The UN inspectors again reported March 7 to the Security Council, once more rebutting the key findings in the NIE that the Bush administration had used to claim Iraq was actively pursuing prohibited weapons.

For example, a full month before the U.S. invasion, the inspectors found strong evidence that Iraq was procuring aluminum tubes for artillery rockets rather than for nuclear weapons material production. The IAEA also exposed as “not authentic” the documents which laid the basis for the claim that Iraq attempted to purchase uranium from Niger.

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Post by ziggy Mon Aug 25, 2008 6:07 pm

The failure to consider the UN inspectors’ pre-invasion findings also has allowed the Bush administration to foist another falsehood on the public and on the lazy press corps: That the administration’s belief that there were prohibited weapons activities in Iraq was based on the intelligence available at the time and that everyone agreed with that assessment.

http://www.armscontrol.org/pressroom/2008/20080605_Iraq_Report
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Post by Aaron Mon Aug 25, 2008 10:02 pm

So you're saying Joseph Biden, chairman of the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations is lying when he stated that weapons inspectors catalogued WMD’s?

And as you're proof, you citing a liberal organization who's stated mission is "promoting public understanding of and support for effective arms control policies" versus the statement of the if the foreign relations expert, so much so that he has been nominated to be the next Vice President of the United States.

Yeah, OK. Forgive me if I doubt your source.
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Post by ziggy Mon Aug 25, 2008 10:26 pm

So you're saying Joseph Biden, chairman of the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations is lying when he stated that weapons inspectors catalogued WMD’s?

If he knew better than that, then yes. That is what lying is, you know- saying something one knows to not be true. If the President can get by with lying about going to war, then why not any Senator- especially one who was in cahoots with it?
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Post by Aaron Mon Aug 25, 2008 10:32 pm

You've got no proof of lying Frank, only outrageous, absurd, ridiculous accusations. If GWB were lying as you’ve ranted about for at least 2 years, he would have already been impeached. The fact that he hasn't been PROVES beyond all doubt that, once again, you’re wrong.
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Post by ziggy Mon Aug 25, 2008 10:59 pm

If GWB were lying as you’ve ranted about for at least 2 years, he would have already been impeached.

By whom? By Republicans and their weak kneed Democratic political cousins in Congress? Those scum bags wouldn't have the courage to impeach a polecat.
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Post by Aaron Mon Aug 25, 2008 11:13 pm

So prove he was lying.
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Post by ziggy Mon Aug 25, 2008 11:21 pm

I don't have to prove anything. Bush proves it every time he opens his mouth. Do you believe him?
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Post by Aaron Tue Aug 26, 2008 7:48 am

I would say that in honesty, integrity and trustworthyness, imo, you and he are very close Frank. In fact, you could actually learn something from him.

But it doesn't matter if I believe him or not. If his detractors, those who have been spouting the same tripe for so long believe he lied and took this country into war based on intentional lies, then prove it, impeach him and then try him.

There are those that think if you tell a lie long enough it becomes the truth and that is simply not the case. Every NIE in the world stated, and the weapons inspectors agreed, Sadaam Hussein has WMD's and was a threat to America. No matter how much you say otherwise doesn't change those simple facts.

Congress had access to the same information and they came to the same conclusion as the President yet you've not railed on them in the same manner as you have the President.

The problem with trying to make the evidence fit the conclusion you came to a long time ago is it simply just doesn't work.
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Post by ziggy Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:58 am

But it doesn't matter if I believe him or not.

I figured you didn't believe him. Looks like I was right.
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