God of some Christians sounds like a tyrant.

Some people have indicated the only way to heaven is through Christ. President Bush made statements indicating he believed that all people, regardless of their specific religion, have a shot at heaven. Now some fundamentalists have their feathers ruffled and consider this some sort of a betrayal.

Why is your god such a tyrant? Really, what's with the rage and the jealousy? Why be so vindictive as to condemn a kind, compassionate, decent, peaceful Jew/Muslim/Buddhist/atheist for eternity simply based upon their specific belief? Why would anybod worship an all knowing, all seeing, omnipotent supernatural tyrant who would open the gates of heaven for a serial killer who finds Christ, but omit the Dahli Lama?

I don't understand why any reasonable, rational person would worship such a being. Yet that is the god many profess to believe in and to worship. I think that Christians who believe in that sort of a god do so out of stark terror. I see very little difference between that sort of Christianity and any of the multitude of others throughout history, right to the present day, that use fear to control the faithful.

I used to be a Catholic, I'm familiar with the scripture. I'm also somewhat familiar with the history of the bible and know that mere mortals haggled for centuries over what would be included and what would not, in addition to all the translations.

In any event, that doesn't answer my questions.

Stephanie wrote:I don't understand why any reasonable, rational person would worship such a being. Yet that is the god many profess to believe in and to worship. I think that Christians who believe in that sort of a god do so out of stark terror. I see very little difference between that sort of Christianity and any of the multitude of others throughout history, right to the present day, that use fear to control the faithful.

Our Gods confirm our desires, and which include authority for the superiority of our own desires over the desires of others.

And it is an extension of the "My dad can whip your dad" syndrome- "My God can whip your God!"

Hi Stephanie,

I would first offer the disclaimer that other people are far better able to present a decent response than I am, but after that disclaimer let me say a few things.

First of all, just because something is unpleasant does not mean that it is not so. I might not want to believe in cavities, but it doesn't stop me from getting them. I might not want to believe in hell, but it doesn't stop it from existing. There are a number of things that I do not "want" to believe in, but I do anyway. I am going to die someday, as are all of my children. My hair is not coming back. The Brewers will not win the World Series.

Let me ponder where next I want to go with this, but let me just reiterate my first point--sometimes reality is not pleasant.

It is no doubt true that God is a jealous God--He says so Himself. I am also a jealous husband as I hope my wife is a jealous wife. I don't wish to share or be shared with others.

If, however, my wife decided that she wanted nothing to do with me and kept insisting on it, would I not be "in the right" to let her go? Would anyone criticize me for my wife's rejection?

I should also like to add a quick thought about hell. It is to be avoided at all costs (and indeed Jesus Christ paid dearly such that we could avoid it). Naturally, the fires of hell will be different than the fires that we now experience, and the nature of bodies will be different also. Remember the story of Lazarus and the Rich Man? Surely someone on fire in Morgantown does not ask for a drop of water to quench his thirst. So while hell is to be avoided, it's chief characteristic is God's chosen absence, however that works. I have to admit that I have a hard time understanding an omnipresent God and the existence of hell; however, as Jesus said much about it, I certainly believe in it's existence.

So, to steal CS Lewis' line, heaven is reached by people saying to God "thy will be done," and hell is reached by people when God says to THEM "fine, your will be done."

Our Gods confirm our desires, and which include authority for the superiority of our own desires over the desires of others.

And it is an extension of the "My dad can whip your dad" syndrome- "My God can whip your God!"

THIS.

What makes islam and christianity extra troublesome is that followers get bonus points for making converts. Indeed, they are commanded to do so. A christian isn't a good christian unless they spread the word.

When it happened, it was kind of new on the religion scene.

It explains how the two end up meshed in governments so frequently.

I don't like jealous people or jealous gods.

Not that I'm going to convert, but I like the Buddhists - you can be one and still belong to most other religions.

Nobody knows the true name of god and it is hubris to suggest otherwise.

John 3:16-21 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

And that passage hasn't been translated a bunch of time through a bunch of languages?

How do you know it didn't say something entirely different before men started playing with it.

How many innocent women have been killed because some bozo translated "poisoner" as "witch"?

TerryRC,

Is it hubris for you to know that my name is Michael? After all, 5.9 billion people don't!

You also mention that you don't care for jealous people. Your wife is willing to share you with others? Really? Don't you want your wife to be faithful to you, and don't you want to be faithful to your wife? Isn't that jealousy, but a very good jealousy indeed?

SheikBen wrote:It is no doubt true that God is a jealous God--He says so Himself.

I should also like to add a quick thought about hell. It is to be avoided at all costs (and indeed Jesus Christ paid dearly such that we could avoid it). Naturally, the fires of hell will be different than the fires that we now experience, and the nature of bodies will be different also.

So while hell is to be avoided, it's chief characteristic is God's chosen absence, however that works. I have to admit that I have a hard time understanding an omnipresent God and the existence of hell; however, as Jesus said much about it, I certainly believe in it's existence.

So, to steal CS Lewis' line, heaven is reached by people saying to God "thy will be done," and hell is reached by people when God says to THEM "fine, your will be done."

Well now, let me give all of you a wee bit of "understanding" about the existance of hell. I mean the "true hell", ...... not some figment of my imagination.

And to do that I hafta snitch the following description of said "true hell" which was posted on MyFamily-Braxton, Pictures and People ….. along with the following comment by the one that posted it.

And I want to forewarn you, ........ if you are not mature and ready to witness what "true hell" really looks like, ............ then don't look any farther down in this post.

.


,



,



Are you sure now, ........ don't look any further if you are squeamishy .......



.


Last chance ......................


,


.

SMALL POX - THIS PICTURE HAS BEEN IN MY MOMS TRUNK ALONG AS I CAN REMEMBER.I HOPE THIS DON'T OFFEND ANYONE I JUST WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHO THEY ARE.I ALWAYS HATED GETTING SHOTS AT SCHOOL AND MOMMY WOULD PULL THIS OUT TO REMIND WHY I NEEDED THE SHOT!

I told ya so.

And you thought I was kidding, ...... that it was just a joke.

.

TerryRC wrote:John 3:16-21 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

And that passage hasn't been translated a bunch of time through a bunch of languages?

How do you know it didn't say something entirely different before men started playing with it.

How many innocent women have been killed because some bozo translated "poisoner" as "witch"?

TerryRC,
The real question is why do you accept the authenticity of the 3 copies of Julius Caesar's "The Gallic Wars" extant and not the thousands of Greek manuscripts of the Greek New Testament? Bias?

SheikBen wrote:It is no doubt true that God is a jealous God--He says so Himself. I am also a jealous husband as I hope my wife is a jealous wife. I don't wish to share or be shared with others.

If, however, my wife decided that she wanted nothing to do with me and kept insisting on it, would I not be "in the right" to let her go? Would anyone criticize me for my wife's rejection?

I should also like to add a quick thought about hell. It is to be avoided at all costs (and indeed Jesus Christ paid dearly such that we could avoid it). Naturally, the fires of hell will be different than the fires that we now experience, and the nature of bodies will be different also. Remember the story of Lazarus and the Rich Man? Surely someone on fire in Morgantown does not ask for a drop of water to quench his thirst. So while hell is to be avoided, it's chief characteristic is God's chosen absence, however that works. I have to admit that I have a hard time understanding an omnipresent God and the existence of hell; however, as Jesus said much about it, I certainly believe in it's existence.

So, to steal CS Lewis' line, heaven is reached by people saying to God "thy will be done," and hell is reached by people when God says to THEM "fine, your will be done."

It is my sincere hope my husband is not jealous. I have never done anything to give him cause to be jealous. I don't think I am a jealous wife. I trust my husband or I wouldn't be with him.

I will admit, that woman who was going to my husband's place of employment flirting with him and asking coworkers where he lives and "what's he like" after being told that he is married did bother me. I'm not sure if that classifies as jealousy or just self-preservation. Where does he live really bothered me.

Does your religion not believe in purgatory? Is that strictly a Catholic thing? Catholics are taught that souls aren't sent to hell simply because they aren't baptized. In the Catholic faith (at least when I was involved) people are taught that those folks go to purgatory where things are not unpleasant, other than that they are "forever denied the sight of god" or words to that effect. Hell, on the other hand, is actually a miserable, torturous experience. The Act of Contrition has changed over the years but the faithful used to pray..."and I detest all my sins because I dread the loss of heaven and the pains of hell". That line has been toned down over the past few decades, that is what my parents learned when they were children.

Stephanie wrote:

SheikBen wrote:It is no doubt true that God is a jealous God--He says so Himself. I am also a jealous husband as I hope my wife is a jealous wife. I don't wish to share or be shared with others.

If, however, my wife decided that she wanted nothing to do with me and kept insisting on it, would I not be "in the right" to let her go? Would anyone criticize me for my wife's rejection?

I should also like to add a quick thought about hell. It is to be avoided at all costs (and indeed Jesus Christ paid dearly such that we could avoid it). Naturally, the fires of hell will be different than the fires that we now experience, and the nature of bodies will be different also. Remember the story of Lazarus and the Rich Man? Surely someone on fire in Morgantown does not ask for a drop of water to quench his thirst. So while hell is to be avoided, it's chief characteristic is God's chosen absence, however that works. I have to admit that I have a hard time understanding an omnipresent God and the existence of hell; however, as Jesus said much about it, I certainly believe in it's existence.

So, to steal CS Lewis' line, heaven is reached by people saying to God "thy will be done," and hell is reached by people when God says to THEM "fine, your will be done."

It is my sincere hope my husband is not jealous. I have never done anything to give him cause to be jealous. I don't think I am a jealous wife. I trust my husband or I wouldn't be with him.

I will admit, that woman who was going to my husband's place of employment flirting with him and asking coworkers where he lives and "what's he like" after being told that he is married did bother me. I'm not sure if that classifies as jealousy or just self-preservation. Where does he live really bothered me.

Does your religion not believe in purgatory? Is that strictly a Catholic thing? Catholics are taught that souls aren't sent to hell simply because they aren't baptized. In the Catholic faith (at least when I was involved) people are taught that those folks go to purgatory where things are not unpleasant, other than that they are "forever denied the sight of god" or words to that effect. Hell, on the other hand, is actually a miserable, torturous experience. The Act of Contrition has changed over the years but the faithful used to pray..."and I detest all my sins because I dread the loss of heaven and the pains of hell". That line has been toned down over the past few decades, that is what my parents learned when they were children.

There is no purgatory. Christ paid for our sins--once for all. If a person could be purged of the guilt of their sin in a purgatory, then why did Christ die--why not just let people purged of all their sin's punishment?

(I just hope that I am not proselytizing or forcing things down people's throats by discussing my religious beliefs...)

OK.......so what happens to all those people who died never having heard of Christ? Now I realize in our ever shrinking world they are fewer than they used to be, but they still exist, and there have been billions who have already died who were born, lived, and died in regions of the world where Christianity had not spread.

Oh, and another thing.....many protestant religions don't baptize their children as infants. What about the kiddies?

Is it hubris for you to know that my name is Michael? After all, 5.9 billion people don't!

Do you think that your name is the only correct one?

I don't think your analogy is apt or you misunderstand the definition of hubris.

To think that you have access to the truth, that you are one of the god's chosen with no evidence but a document thousands of years old, toyed with and re-translated by multiple people, that you and yours are right and everyone else is wrong - what other word but hubris can apply?

You also mention that you don't care for jealous people. Your wife is willing to share you with others? Really? Don't you want your wife to be faithful to you, and don't you want to be faithful to your wife? Isn't that jealousy, but a very good jealousy indeed?

If my wife has an itch she can't avoid scratching, I'll probably tolerate it, if she is discrete. I would rather have her used than not at all. She has told me the same thing.

I haven't scratched any itches because I haven't had them. I haven't asked about hers.

Jealousy stems from insecurity and no jealousy is good. I believe the only way you can possess someone else is is to possess one's self.

TerryRC,
The real question is why do you accept the authenticity of the 3 copies of Julius Caesar's "The Gallic Wars" extant and not the thousands of Greek manuscripts of the Greek New Testament? Bias?

How do you know that I accept the authenticity of the Greek translations The Gallic Wars?

I'd prefer to see it in the original Latin.

You are making a strawman argument.

In other words, your question is little more than propaganda.

Was the NT originally written in Greek? If not, why would I trust a Greek version? Is the RKJV the true bible or is the The Douay-Rheims translation of the Roman Catholic bible the true bible?

(I just hope that I am not proselytizing or forcing things down people's throats by discussing my religious beliefs...)

Just don't make believing it a condition of registration and I will leave you alone...

Armon Ayers wrote:
There is no purgatory. Christ paid for our sins--once for all. If a person could be purged of the guilt of their sin in a purgatory, then why did Christ die--why not just let people purged of all their sin's punishment?

(I just hope that I am not proselytizing or forcing things down people's throats by discussing my religious beliefs...)

What I want to know is, ....... where was Jesus Christ during his philandering years?

You know the "years" I mean, ........ the years of ...... teenager to 30.

There is no historical references ....... and the Scriptures are DEATHLY SILENT on the subject of his whereabouts.

Now that is bout 20 years that Jesus was incognito ......... and I wanna know where he was.

I mean like someone of his importance just wouldn't, ...... shouldn't, ........ up and disappear for that length of time, ...... RIGHT.

HUUUUUMMMM, maybe that is where that "ole saying" got its origin ......... but they modified it in later years.

Whereas now days people will remark ...... "Where in Christ's name did you get that from?", ......... or, ....... "Why in Jesus's name did you do that?", .........

but way back yonder they were saying ...... "Where did Christ just get back from after 20 years?", ......... or, ....... "Now just why did Jesus stay gone for so long?"



.

I don't agree with any of this but many of you will...

http://www.tnr.com/booksarts/story.html?id=f0834fa0-9d9d-42ab-8cae-9127491c7c0e

TerryRC wrote:Jealousy stems from insecurity and no jealousy is good. I believe the only way you can possess someone else is is to possess one's self.

Well said.

ziggy wrote:

TerryRC wrote:Jealousy stems from insecurity and no jealousy is good.

Well said.

Well now, I'm not so sure I agree with the part about ...... "no jealousy is good".

With some spouses ............. they prefer and/or thrive on ..... a little bit of jealously being exhibited from/by the other party.

And if their better half doesn't exhibit enough "to please them" ........ then things can go to hell in a handbasket real quick like.

cheers

Stephanie wrote:

SheikBen wrote:It is no doubt true that God is a jealous God--He says so Himself. I am also a jealous husband as I hope my wife is a jealous wife. I don't wish to share or be shared with others.

If, however, my wife decided that she wanted nothing to do with me and kept insisting on it, would I not be "in the right" to let her go? Would anyone criticize me for my wife's rejection?

I should also like to add a quick thought about hell. It is to be avoided at all costs (and indeed Jesus Christ paid dearly such that we could avoid it). Naturally, the fires of hell will be different than the fires that we now experience, and the nature of bodies will be different also. Remember the story of Lazarus and the Rich Man? Surely someone on fire in Morgantown does not ask for a drop of water to quench his thirst. So while hell is to be avoided, it's chief characteristic is God's chosen absence, however that works. I have to admit that I have a hard time understanding an omnipresent God and the existence of hell; however, as Jesus said much about it, I certainly believe in it's existence.

So, to steal CS Lewis' line, heaven is reached by people saying to God "thy will be done," and hell is reached by people when God says to THEM "fine, your will be done."

It is my sincere hope my husband is not jealous. I have never done anything to give him cause to be jealous. I don't think I am a jealous wife. I trust my husband or I wouldn't be with him.

I will admit, that woman who was going to my husband's place of employment flirting with him and asking coworkers where he lives and "what's he like" after being told that he is married did bother me. I'm not sure if that classifies as jealousy or just self-preservation. Where does he live really bothered me.

Does your religion not believe in purgatory? Is that strictly a Catholic thing? Catholics are taught that souls aren't sent to hell simply because they aren't baptized. In the Catholic faith (at least when I was involved) people are taught that those folks go to purgatory where things are not unpleasant, other than that they are "forever denied the sight of god" or words to that effect. Hell, on the other hand, is actually a miserable, torturous experience. The Act of Contrition has changed over the years but the faithful used to pray..."and I detest all my sins because I dread the loss of heaven and the pains of hell". That line has been toned down over the past few decades, that is what my parents learned when they were children.

You are not willing to share your husband with others? That's a very good thing. When someone sought out his affection, you were rightfully pissed. I insist on that character in my wife. Once when she was dating she heard that a girl was interested in me, and she wanted to beat the tar out of her. That was hot.

But beyond that, it's right for a spouse to be jealous, pure and simple. Our spouses are for us and we are for our spouses; their attention should not be paid to another. It is the same with God. As the Song of Solomon says "I am my beloved's and my beloved is mine." He is right not to want to share us with an idol or with this world, yet still He allows to go if we insist.

As far as purgatory goes: no, I do not believe that it exists. However, I do believe that hell is far more bearable for some people than for others, just as heaven will be more glorious for some people than it will be for others. Luke 12:48 "But the one who did not know and did things deserving of blows will be beaten lightly. Much will be required of everyone who has been given much. And even more will be expected of the one who has been entrusted with more." I think this speaks both to the virtuous pagans as well as to those who have never heard the gospel. While I believe from the Scriptures that hope is found only in Jesus Christ, there will be more bearable conditions for some than for others. When Jesus Christ says that some people will find the day of judgement more bearable than others, I believe Him. Hell is characterized by a certain character of God's absence and is to be avoided at all costs. At the same time, there are degrees that are very real. The virtuous pagan is, in my opinion, in hell and continuing life not terribly different than how he left it. God has cast him/her out of his presence, but they were never really there to begin with/they never knew Him.

Of course I'm not willing to share my husband. What really bothers me about that woman is that knowing he is married she is still is trying to find out where he lives. Michael, that is a little frightening to me. Why does she want to know where he lives? He lives with me and our children. She shows up at my door and he isn't home, I will certainly take that as a danger to myself and my children. People are nuts. I worry about her because his coworkers refer to her as his stalker.

Have you read Dante? I thought he had a very dark, but very interesting, view of hell & purgatory.
While I'm certain my husband isn't every woman's cup of tea, he has had others express interest in him over the years, sometimes in my presence. I actually sometimes enjoy that. Call me twisted, but I've got an "eat your heart out" attitude. LOL We do not look like we belong together. He is young and fit and sort of dangerous looking...I am middle aged, overweight, and I look like what I am....a grandmother.

You are not willing to share your husband with others? That's a very good thing. When someone sought out his affection, you were rightfully pissed. I insist on that character in my wife. Once when she was dating she heard that a girl was interested in me, and she wanted to beat the tar out of her. That was hot.

Why would you be pissed unless you didn't trust your husband or wife?

My wife is hit on by other guys on an almost daily basis, which is to be expected when you rob the cradle (my wife is almost a decade younger than me). It doesn't bother me as I trust her and know she (probably) isn't having any.

Jealousy just doesn't pay off, in the end.

TerryRC wrote:You are not willing to share your husband with others? That's a very good thing. When someone sought out his affection, you were rightfully pissed. I insist on that character in my wife. Once when she was dating she heard that a girl was interested in me, and she wanted to beat the tar out of her. That was hot.

Why would you be pissed unless you didn't trust your husband or wife?

My wife is hit on by other guys on an almost daily basis, which is to be expected when you rob the cradle (my wife is almost a decade younger than me). It doesn't bother me as I trust her and know she (probably) isn't having any.

Jealousy just doesn't pay off, in the end.

I'm not talking about being possessive; I'm talking about jealousy. People never suppose it can be a good thing.

Let's say my children are paying more attention to some show on television than they are to me. Would I not be right to be jealous and then insist that they turn off the television? Is not my relationship with them more important than who Brittany Spears' baby's daddy is?