Palin is a birther...

You said tires would cost me more if I lived in MA then WV and when I did a price comparison on not only models but different tire sizes at Wal Mart, they gave me the same price on every tire so your claim that tires cost more in MA then WV is false.

You realize that those people who are paying between $300-400 per month for insurance, if they're employed, they're only paying a portion of thier insurance. Most companies pay above 75% of the premium for a single plan meaning the true cost of the insurance is $1,200 to $1,500 per month.

So if $250 is affordable, who's paying the other $750.00 of my premium?

And if you don't believe my figure, google "average profit margin of health insurance" and see for yourself.

Aaron wrote:You said tires would cost me more if I lived in MA then WV and when I did a price comparison on not only models but different tire sizes at Wal Mart, they gave me the same price on every tire so your claim that tires cost more in MA then WV is false.

You realize that those people who are paying between $300-400 per month for insurance, if they're employed, they're only paying a portion of thier insurance. Most companies pay above 75% of the premium for a single plan meaning the true cost of the insurance is $1,200 to $1,500 per month.

So if $250 is affordable, who's paying the other $750.00 of my premium?

And if you don't believe my figure, google "average profit margin of health insurance" and see for yourself.

Was that internet prices? Internet prices are not the same as in store purchases. Number one I believe the goal is to lower the cost of healthcare. My friend paid for her own without help and paid 500.00 per month for a minimal Blue Cross plan. If a premium is $1500 dollars per month is that not exorbitant? What is 2% to them. To oil companies 2% would still be billions of dollars. What is the actual monetary figure. Two percent could still be considerable.

No, that is not internet prices. That was prices for a store in Boston and one in Chrarleston. They're the same.

And why is $1500 deductible exorbiant? Part of the problem with healthcare is Cadillac plans with the reason being consumers don't care how much an office visit or specific test that may or may not be needed cost because they're not paying for it.

As for the dollar amount, I guess since that suddenly matters, you googled and found out I was correct. So my question remains, how is a 2% profit margin greedy?

You guys have universal health care in Massachusetts Andrea. Why don't you tell us how that is working out for you guys up there.

Aaron,

I think you hit on the crucial point in all of this. If universal health insurance is such a great idea, why don't the states try it first to see if it works out?

Because they have, and it hasn't.

Aaron wrote:You guys have universal health care in Massachusetts Andrea. Why don't you tell us how that is working out for you guys up there.

Perhaps misery loves company?

Jealousy accounts for quite alot these days.

Keli wrote:

Aaron wrote:You guys have universal health care in Massachusetts Andrea. Why don't you tell us how that is working out for you guys up there.

Perhaps misery loves company?

It hasn't worked here as well as it might. But we don't have a public option her either. It all centers around private insurance. The prices doing it that way didn't come down that much. Also many employers found a way around the law. Many people like my friend pay large amounts of money for their premium.

If 2% is billions of dollars then that is a lot of money. Businesses are made up of people. We always talk about good citizenry and business people are still citizens of the United States. If taking a bit less profit could help more people to have health care, then why shouldn't they to be good participants in American society? Why does the code we apply to ourselves, not apply to them? If everyone paid $1500 dollars a month for a premium, how many of them do you think use any of their coverage. Do you go to the doctor every month? How many major illnesses, operations, etc have you had that would use up the amount paid in premiums? It's really a security blanket, in case of need. Even Linus might think $1500 dollars a month was a bit expensive for a blanket. Especially one without a place to put his thumb.

It hasn't work as well as it might?

Health care cost have doubled, hundreds of thousands are still without insurance dispite mandated coverage, those who are covered face higher premiums and find it increasingly difficult to find a physician as they face a massive shortage of doctors and interns.

source

I would say it hasn't worked as well as it might is an understatement.

As for the profit margin, first you said 2% wasn't the correct number. Then when you found out it was, you said but that doesn't matter because it's a lot of money. Seems to me that your mind is made up so why don't you tell us, how much is an acceptable profit margin?

And who besides corporations providing insurance for their employees are paying $1500 a month for health insurance?

Given the fact that you are a moderate Andrea, I'm curious, how do you reconcile the fact that a health insurance companies 2% profit margin is acceptable because it involves a lot of mone? That line of thinking is surely not moderate.

I am curious though that as a moderate, how do you feel about that fact that Medicare loses ~16% of it's overall budget to graft, fraud, corruption, mismanagement and outright incompetence on an annual basis?

Does it not infuriate you as it does other moderates to know that the government is throwing $60 billion dollars of our tax dollars away on an annual basis with complete knowledge of how happening?

And how does your moderate views deal with the simple fact that they ignore it and continue to pay claims they know to be fraudulent with no means to recoup the losses?

The sad thing is, this could never happen with private insurance because they couldn't afford to lose $60 billion dollars a year as their profits at 2% annually isn't $60 billion.

And as a moderate, how do you feel about the fact that Medicare now faces an unfunded liability of $45 trillion which wouldn't be nearly as scary were it not for the fact that the trust fund is going bankrupt, set to run out by 2017?

With that being the case, do you as a moderate disagree with moderates in Congress and support an expansion of the Medicare program in which 30 million Americans (a group of which only about 3 million are currently uninsured) are given the option of buying into Medicare?

I’ll await your response.

Armon Ayers wrote:If you guys do not take it easy on you-know-who, you are going to chase you-know-who off--just like you did all the others.

Looks like we ran her off. As I don't think anyone was overly rude though, I'm pretty sure it was the her inability to answer questions but that's just my opinion.

She'll be back, I wager.

In the meantime, what do you all think a true moderate would look like? What would they be likely to believe?

A true moderate would look, and believe, and think, and act precisely as I do!

Stephanie wrote:A true moderate would look, and believe, and think, and act precisely as I do!

I am a-Pauled at your moderation.

I am "moderately" suspicious of your self-identification:)

OK, so now answer the question. What might a given moderate believe?

I think ideological labels are often misleading. As a Christian, I find a great deal to be morally wrong that I do not particularly want to make illegal. But I get off the libertarian train when it comes to abortion, but then I am back on it when it comes to drug legalization, the abolition of the income tax, withdrawl of foreign aid and our troops from overseas, etc. I also intend on educating my children at home and favor the elimination of the US Department of Education. Now I am no "moderate," but I cannot imagine most conservatives coming out for drug legalization. I don't think very many of us really have any kind of ideological 'purity' and I think that is a good thing. AC has stated that she is pro-life, which is not an easy thing for a liberal to do.

I'm not sure what a moderate is Mike. I think it's somone that can't quite make up their mind.

I'm not a democrat because I don't agree with fiscally, mostly because they don't have a clue. I'm not a Republican because I don't agree with them on some of the issues you stated or on some of the social issues.

I'm certainly not a libertarian because I don't believe in anarchy and even though I agree with them on legalization, it's probably not for the same reason.

So I can't answer your question because I'm not sure what a moderate is.

SheikBen wrote:She'll be back, I wager.

You giving odds?

I bet you biscuits and gravy at the Tudor's in Nitro she'll be back by next Tuesday, the 22nd.

But will she undergo a name change?

You're on Mike.

Steph you can be in on this, too. I haven't been down to WVA in a while and I have several days off coming up. B and G for all if AC does not resurface.

Ah well Mike, you win this bet. Aaron isn't anywhere near as savvy as he thinks he is. I was working. Several shifts as a matter of fact. Had an opportunity for the big pay day before Christmas and took advantage of it. I love those double time and a half paying shifts. That's one thing about living in MA. I can see the cart full of Christmas presents already. I don't answer questions Aaron? I haven't found you too much of a 'great mind' at answering them yourself. The 'this is what the constitution says because I say so' gets old really quick.
When I talked about equipment companies that wrongfully charge for things you didn't seem concerned in the least. Yet fraud in Medicare seems to give you apoplexy. Now why is it different when a business defrauds someone and someone with Medicare does? That's the problem with that old way to the right view. It only sees one side of things.

When I talked about equipment companies that wrongfully charge for things you didn't seem concerned in the least. Yet fraud in Medicare seems to give you apoplexy. Now why is it different when a business defrauds someone and someone with Medicare does? That's the problem with that old way to the right view. It only sees one side of things..

Speaking for myself and not Aaron:

Medicare frauds rob us all. Every taxpayer suffers. Every future taxpayer suffers. These criminals that set up shop in strip malls using information they have purchased from criminals working in hospitals and clinics steal millions of taxpayer dollars by defrauding Medicare, they aren't brought to trial and made to pay restitution. They close up shop and relocate to steal some more.

The government you are so anxious to take over the entire healthcare industry is unwilling, or unable to prevent this. They are unwilling or unable to seek justice and restitution from the ever increasing number of thieves robbing us blind each and every day, yet you wish to give them even more money to piss away. You wish to give these incompetent boobs even more control over the healthcare of every man woman and child in the nation.

You'll have to pardon me if such irrational thinking gives me fits. Lunacy and stupidity have a way of doing that to me.

Ah but considering the fact that most of the thefts are carried out by big businesses and is usually paid for by government funds such as Medicare or Medicaid, why do I not see any kind of reaction in this thread to hold them accountable. It is equipment companies, drug companies etc that overcharge for their products. I don't see anyone here holding them accountable. You want to blame Medicare and Medicaid. How about blaming the thief for once. Is thievery acceptable for them? How about bringing businesses to trial and having them pay restitution for their thefts? I see a distinct bias as to whom you are willing to call a thief. Hospitals and clinics are thieves. Equipment companies are just 'making a profit'. My what a double standard.