A monkey is the Pope's uncle.

VATICAN CITY (CNS) -- While apes evolved naturally into pre-human creatures, it was the will and desire of God that turned them into humans, an article in the Vatican newspaper said.

"The formation of human beings necessitated a particular contribution by God, though it remains that their emergence was brought about by natural causes" of evolution, it said.

The article, published in the May 5-6 edition of L'Osservatore Romano, was written by Italian evolutionary biologist Fiorenzo Facchini.

The article said that, "when the biological conditions necessary for supporting a being capable of reflective thought were attained, the will of God, the creator, freely desired it, and man came to be."

The article posed the question: Does this mean that humans evolved from chimpanzees?

"No, it might be better to say that at some point God willed a spark of intelligence to light up in the mind of a nonhuman hominid and thus came into existence the human as a being, as a subject capable of thought and the ability to decide freely," it said.

So rather than picturing it as humans descending from the apes, it said, humans ascended or rose up from the animal kingdom to a higher level, thanks to the hand of God.

As Pope Benedict XVI wrote in 1968 when he was Father Joseph Ratzinger, God wanted to create a being that could know him and be able to turn to him, the article said.

The emergence of the human is neither a casual or accidental event, nor is it something that was "strictly necessary," demanded by God or the evolutionary process, it said.

Evolution could have ended at the pre-human stage, it said, but thanks to "the free choice of God," humans emerged from their pre-human ancestors.

This divine intervention "does not represent an unwarranted intrusion (of theology) in the field of science -- as is the case with intelligent design -- but is called for in order to explain the presence of man's spirit" which cannot come from or evolve out of the material world, the article said.

The movement from being a creature of the animal and physical world to also the spiritual was a gift from God "even if it came at the end of a natural process of evolution," it said.

but is called for in order to explain the presence of man's spirit"

SamCogar wrote:

but is called for in order to explain the presence of man's spirit"

And I wonder just what is that "spirit" he is talking about that none of the other higher primates were blessed with?

,

Armon Ayers wrote:

SamCogar wrote:

but is called for in order to explain the presence of man's spirit"

And I wonder just what is that "spirit" he is talking about that none of the other higher primates were blessed with?

,

This is a new twist on we descended from apes--this means that Adam's and Eve's parents were apes, i.e. subhumans!

Apes are the members of the Hominoidea superfamily of primates, which includes humans. Under the current classification system there are two families of hominoids:

1. the family Hylobatidae consists of 4 genera and 13 species of gibbons, including the Lar Gibbon and the Siamang, collectively known as the "lesser apes"

2. the family Hominidae consisting of orangutans, gorillas, chimpanzees, and humans, collectively known as the great apes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ape

SamCogar wrote:

And the only "subhumans" there are, ........ are those humans that don't act as humans should be acting.

And there is sure as hell plenty of them.

.

Armon Ayers wrote:A few weeks ago, the Vatican said that it is alright for Catholics to believe in ETs--"if there are ETs, then God created them." Really? "Created them?" Why didn't he use the monkey-business process on them, as well?

SamCogar wrote:

Armon Ayers wrote:A few weeks ago, the Vatican said that it is alright for Catholics to believe in ETs--"if there are ETs, then God created them." Really? "Created them?" Why didn't he use the monkey-business process on them, as well?

WHAT, ....... you doubt that there are ET's?

My gawd man, ….. that is heretical is it not?

Why the Bible itself makes 3 or 4 references to ET's ...... and you have the audacity to question their existance.

Fer shame, ........ fer shame.

.

SamCogar wrote:You don't do much reading through the Bible, do you?

Stephanie wrote:Wouldn't that make the monkey the Pope's uncle, not the other way around?

Armon Ayers wrote:

SamCogar wrote:You don't do much reading through the Bible, do you?

Educate me.

Spacecraft and Extraterrestrials in the Bible and History
http://www.sanandaseagles.com/pages/spacecraft_in_bible.html

2 SAMUEL 22:10 He bowed the heavens also, and came down; and darkness was under his feet. 11 And he rode upon a cherub, and did fly: and he was seen upon the wings of the wind.

2 KINGS 2:11 And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.

2 KINGS 6:17 And Elisha prayed, and said, Lord, I pray thee, open his eyes, that he may see. And the Lord opened the eyes of the young man; and he saw: and, behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire round about Elisha.

ISAIAH 60:8 Who are these that fly as a cloud, and as the doves to their windows

EZEKIEL 1:4 And I looked, and, behold, a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud, and a fire infolding itself, and a brightness was about it, and out of the midst thereof as the colour of amber, out of the midst of the fire.

ZECHARIAH 5:1 Then I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a flying roll. 2 And he said unto me, What seest thou? And I answered, I see a flying roll; the length thereof is twenty cubits, and the breadth thereof ten cubits.

REVELATION 10:1 And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, clothed with a cloud: and a rainbow was upon his head, and his face was as it were the sun, and his feet as pillars of fire:

SamCogar wrote:

Armon Ayers wrote:

SamCogar wrote:You don't do much reading through the Bible, do you?

Educate me.

Armony, since I figure you will argue with anything I say if I don't cite a Book, Chapter, Verse reference ...... I will cite this url reference whereby someone has already provided many of said.

Here below I have extracted 7 of the many that are noted:

Spacecraft and Extraterrestrials in the Bible and History
http://www.sanandaseagles.com/pages/spacecraft_in_bible.html

2 SAMUEL 22:10 He bowed the heavens also, and came down; and darkness was under his feet. 11 And he rode upon a cherub, and did fly: and he was seen upon the wings of the wind.

2 KINGS 2:11 And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.

2 KINGS 6:17 And Elisha prayed, and said, Lord, I pray thee, open his eyes, that he may see. And the Lord opened the eyes of the young man; and he saw: and, behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire round about Elisha.

ISAIAH 60:8 Who are these that fly as a cloud, and as the doves to their windows

EZEKIEL 1:4 And I looked, and, behold, a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud, and a fire infolding itself, and a brightness was about it, and out of the midst thereof as the colour of amber, out of the midst of the fire.

ZECHARIAH 5:1 Then I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a flying roll. 2 And he said unto me, What seest thou? And I answered, I see a flying roll; the length thereof is twenty cubits, and the breadth thereof ten cubits.

REVELATION 10:1 And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, clothed with a cloud: and a rainbow was upon his head, and his face was as it were the sun, and his feet as pillars of fire:

Now Armony, if per chance you choose to critique those references, ........ be very, very, very careful about the verbiage you use.

I say that because such Bibllical text is either fact or fiction, inclusive.

Ya can't have it both ways, pickin n' choosin which ones ya want which way.


.

Armon Ayers wrote:God made pre-humans into people, Vatican newspaper says

By Carol Glatz
Catholic News Service

VATICAN CITY (CNS) -- While apes evolved naturally into pre-human creatures, it was the will and desire of God that turned them into humans, an article in the Vatican newspaper said.

"The formation of human beings necessitated a particular contribution by God, though it remains that their emergence was brought about by natural causes" of evolution, it said.

The article, published in the May 5-6 edition of L'Osservatore Romano, was written by Italian evolutionary biologist Fiorenzo Facchini.

The article said that, "when the biological conditions necessary for supporting a being capable of reflective thought were attained, the will of God, the creator, freely desired it, and man came to be."

The article posed the question: Does this mean that humans evolved from chimpanzees?

"No, it might be better to say that at some point God willed a spark of intelligence to light up in the mind of a nonhuman hominid and thus came into existence the human as a being, as a subject capable of thought and the ability to decide freely," it said.

So rather than picturing it as humans descending from the apes, it said, humans ascended or rose up from the animal kingdom to a higher level, thanks to the hand of God.

As Pope Benedict XVI wrote in 1968 when he was Father Joseph Ratzinger, God wanted to create a being that could know him and be able to turn to him, the article said.

The emergence of the human is neither a casual or accidental event, nor is it something that was "strictly necessary," demanded by God or the evolutionary process, it said.

Evolution could have ended at the pre-human stage, it said, but thanks to "the free choice of God," humans emerged from their pre-human ancestors.

This divine intervention "does not represent an unwarranted intrusion (of theology) in the field of science -- as is the case with intelligent design -- but is called for in order to explain the presence of man's spirit" which cannot come from or evolve out of the material world, the article said.

The movement from being a creature of the animal and physical world to also the spiritual was a gift from God "even if it came at the end of a natural process of evolution," it said.

END

SamCogar wrote:

Armon Ayers wrote:

SamCogar wrote:

but is called for in order to explain the presence of man's spirit"

And I wonder just what is that "spirit" he is talking about that none of the other higher primates were blessed with?

,

This is a new twist on we descended from apes--this means that Adam's and Eve's parents were apes, i.e. subhumans!

AAAAAWWWW, silly man, ...... we are apes, ..... no decending required. To wit:

Apes are the members of the Hominoidea superfamily of primates, which includes humans. Under the current classification system there are two families of hominoids:

1. the family Hylobatidae consists of 4 genera and 13 species of gibbons, including the Lar Gibbon and the Siamang, collectively known as the "lesser apes"

2. the family Hominidae consisting of orangutans, gorillas, chimpanzees, and humans, collectively known as the great apes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ape

Us humans are also referred to as the "naked ape" and the "acquatic ape".

And the only "subhumans" there are, ........ are those humans that don't act as humans should be acting.

And there is sure as hell plenty of them.

.

I disagree that intelligent design is religion. Intelligent design is using science to try and finally settle the age old question of whether the design that everyone concedes is present in biology is real or just apparent; that is, whether or not things like bacterial flagella are the products of an intelligence agency or whether they just look like they are.

TerryRC wrote:A monkey could not be the Pope's uncle because we are not descended from monkeys, but rather, if I might indulge in the sort of pedantry the materialists are famous for, some putative ape-like critter that none one has ever seen or has evidence for.

You would be wrong about that. Transitional hominid and proto-hominid forms have been discovered. Even if we can't prove that some of them were our immediate ancestors, it shows these transitional forms DO exist.

TerryRC wrote:Intelligent design is using science to try and finally settle the age old question of whether the design that everyone concedes is present in biology is real or just apparent; that is, whether or not things like bacterial flagella are the products of an intelligence agency or whether they just look like they are.

How? How does one do that?

ziggy wrote:

I disagree that intelligent design is religion. Intelligent design is using science to try and finally settle the age old question of whether the design that everyone concedes is present in biology is real or just apparent; that is, whether or not things like bacterial flagella are the products of an intelligence agency or whether they just look like they are.

(bold emphasis added by Ziggy)

Or is apparent "design" simply assigned by the human mind in an effort to make some sense of it all- as a starting point for further speculation and investigation?

There are only two reasons I can think of and one is less legitimate than the other: One is that science operates via methodological naturalism; that is, in order to keep theology from encroaching into the realm of science, science must confine all explanations and hypotheses to purely naturalistic causes. Which is all well and good if we are talking about explaining gravity or lightening.

ziggy wrote:We know- or at least think we know- more about gravity than we do about how man came to exist.